UNIVERSITY OF WISCONSIN-MADISON ARCHIVES
ORAL HISTORY PROJECT

Interview #225
RUEDISILI, CHESTER H.

RUEDISILI, Chester H. (1910-2002)
Undergraduate and Graduate Student; Professor of Psychology; Associate Dean of College of Letters and Science
At UW: 1929-1980

First Interview
Interviewed: 	1982	
Interviewer: 	Donna Hartshorne
Length: 	5 hours, 11 minutes

Background; Undergraduate jobs; Decision to go into psychology; Appointment as assistant and then associate dean; Work with freshmen; Teaching; Protest movement; Mark Ingraham's reorganization of dean's office; Beginning of honors program; SOAR program; Grants for honors theses; Biology core curriculum; Big Ten Honors Committee; Honors program under various deans; Survey of foreign students and faculty; Carnegie grant to work with black undergraduates; Student personnel services and institutes in Japan; Brittingham Viking Scholars program; University Faculty Assembly; Faculty Senate; Minimum credits issue; Disciplinary action against students; Computerization of student personnel files; Changes in admissions policy; ILS; UW's contribution to American Association of University Professors; Area studies programs; Institute for Environmental Studies; Junior year abroad; Special study for undergraduates; Career advising; Committee on Student Conduct and Appeals; ROTC; Dormitory issues; Commencement; His responsibilities as South Hall building custodian; Relations with regents; Anecdotes about Ingraham.

Second Interview1
Interviewed: 	1993	
Interviewer: 	Barry Teicher
Length: 	48 minutes

President Clarence Dykstra and Personnel Council; Changes on campus due to WWII; Counseling for male students bound for armed services; Military programs on campus; Harry S. Truman and atomic bomb; Veterans as students.

FIRST INTERVIEW

First Interview Session (June 24, 1982): Digital File

Time		Keywords
00:00:00		Start of Interview 

00:00:01		Birth and early life.  Elementary schooling.  High school commercial course.

00:01:45		High Y Club of North Division High School.  Director's encouragement to prepare for college.

00:02:05		High School graduation.  Right subjects for college but no money.  Year of work.

00:02:32		Jobs: stock boy in shoe store, desk clerk at downtown YMCA, rod man in City Engineer's office.

00:03:13		Projects as a rod man.

00:04:15		UW freshman.  Discourages by Dean of Engineering Adam V. Millar from majoring in engineering.

00:04:25		Consideration of physical education major.  Reasons.

00:04:52		Three semesters of Extension study in Milwaukee.  Preparatory courses for West Point.

00:05:30		Failed West Point physical.  Return to Madison as a math major, then a psychology major.

00:05:50		Graduation from UW, in psychology, in 1933.

00:06:15		Description of attempts to enter West Point.  High blood pressure.  

00:08:03		Giving up math as a major.

00:08:22		Why choice of psychology.  Influence of Professor Richard W. Husband.

00:09:04		Vocational school courses in Milwaukee after graduation.  Part-time jobs.

00:09:24		CWA project in Madison, through Alanson H. Edgerton.  Edgerton's prior influence in area of counseling.  Relationship to psychology major.

00:10:09		Job at Washington High School, Milwaukee, as first boys; counselor—and math teacher.

00:11:04		UW TA job in psychology, through Professor Husband.  Salary and work load.

00:11:45		Becoming assistant to Junior Dean, Harry Glicksman.  Division of work between Glicksman and Dean Sellery.

00:12:44		Full time in the dean's office, plus full graduate load.

00:13:15		Harry Glicksman praised.

00:13:34		Ph.D. in 1941.  Appointment as assistant dean, and lecturer in psychology.  New courses he taught.

00:15:08		Salary as beginning teacher.

00:15:50		Promotions.  Glicksman's retirement from deanship.  CR as associate dean in charge of the academic aspect of the L&S dean's office.

00:16:40		CR's early responsibilities in the dean's office—freshman problems.  Examples.

00:17:34		Working with office of dean of women.  Louise Troxell.  Help from Assistant dean Susan B. Davis on freshman problems.  Helen Kayser worked with Glicksman on sophomore problems.

00:18:20		Job responsibilities.  Annette C. Washburn was student psychiatrist.

00:19:00		Primary student problems—scholastic difficulties.  Doing checks of 6-weeks grades.  Action taken.

00:19:50		Discussions of "sophomore slump."  Generational student concerns and worries.  Their relationship to grades.

00:21:28		Teaching courses of V. A. C. Henmon.  Circumstances.  Value to CR for teaching his own courses later.

00:23:50		Protest years of the late '60s.  South Hall as a center of rioting and tear gas activity.  Unhappy effects on students and faculty.

00:25:34		Effects on honors students generally less.

00:26:08		South Hall fire bombed; files destroyed; sit-in; broken windows.

00:27:34		Mark Ingraham's organizational changes of the dean's office described.  CR promoted to associate dean when Glicksman left.

00:29:20		Reasons CR thought the changes an improvement.

00:30:22		Beginnings of the honors program.  Committee chairman Andrew H. Clark.  Alvin Whitely first chairman of the Honors Program.

00:31:55		Honors Program growth.

00:32:43		How the program worked.  Admissions requirements.  Honors courses described—two types.  Examples in chemistry, German.

00:36:05		Requirements for an honors degree.  Total credits needed.

00:37:50		Counseling honors students.  CR's assistant, Dean Barbara Ann Wiley Peterson.

00:38:55		SOAR program (Summer Orientation, Advising, and Registration) for new freshmen.  Advantages for Honors Program.

00:41:15		Areas of counseling for honors students.  Student input for honors course work.  Faculty informed.

00:42:28		Contact with parents minimal.  Reasons.

00:43:06		Dean's office organization when CR became dean of the Honors Program.  Dean Blair H. Mathews, then Dean F. Chandler Young in charge of the four Madison colleges with honors programs—L&S, Business, Family Resources and Consumer Sciences, Agriculture and Life Sciences.

00:47:08		National Collegiate Honors Council.  Membership.  CR active; president 1979-80.  Location of meetings.  Program sessions.  Activities nation-wide.

00:49:44		End of Tape 1

Tape 2

00:49:46		Accrediting honors programs.  Reasons against.  Differences of individual institutions.  Advantages of the Collegiate Honors Council and its workshops.  Its usefulness to CR.

00:51:00		Financial grants for senior honors these.  Glenn and Serita Trewartha fund—THURF (Trewartha Undergraduate Research Fund).  First 3 recipients 1969.

00:54:20		Knapp funding for ten weeks summer work on senior honors thesis.  Plan aided by Seymour Abrahamson (zoology) on the honors committee, and his wife Shirley (law) who was chairman of the Knapp Committee.  Amounts given, over time.  Brittingham money and Fraser funds.

00:57:07		Result of this funding—some outstanding theses.  Some notable UW scholars as advisors.

00:57:54		Biology Core Curriculum.

00:59:41		Makeup and terms of Faculty Honors Committee.  Role of CR as Chairman of the committee and the program.  Now F. Chandler Young.  Some administrative changes seen as possible.

01:01:31		End of First Interview Session

Second Interview Session (June 29, 1982): Digital File

Time		Keywords
00:00:01		Start of Interview 

00:00:01		CIC Honors Subcommittee, in Big Ten.  Origins.  Richard Marsh—University of Illinois—first chairman.  Arrangements—Sam Schragge of Chicago Circle campus.  Information and idea sharing.  Current chairman Warner Chapman of Indiana University.  Value of the group.

00:02:03		Efforts to develop similar procedure with honors program within the UW system.  Results.

00:03:49		Sophomore Honors—first award, at the end of second year of honors work.

00:05:48		Major problems—drop in number of honors courses as a result of budget cuts.  Other unfortunate results.

00:07:40		Loss of honors office, 301 South Hall.  CR's unsuccessful efforts to avoid the change.  Dean Young's role in this.  Reason's CR feels results most unfortunate.  Review Committee's support for an Honors Program center.

00:11:10		F. Chandler Young as acting chairman of faculty honors committee.  In effect,work done by assistant deans Barbara P. Wiley and Pamela G. Miller.  Commitment of Honors Program chairmen discussed.

00:12:08		Hope for action by L&S Dean Cronon to provide an Honors Program office.

00:13:14		Getting departments to offer honors courses.  Dean Ingraham a staunch supporter.  Professor Whitley's job organizing the Honors Program.

00:14:20		Comparison of enthusiasm for honors work of the L&S deans—Epstein, Kleene, Cronon, Ingraham.  Participation by Cronon's son.

00:16:03		Role of faculty honors committee in running the Honors Program.  Suggested improvements.

00:17:00		Student honors committee.  Membership.  Responsibilities.

00:18:35		Student honors committee unofficial.  Its origin.

00:19:05		Frequency of meetings for both faculty and student committees.

00:19:18		Limitation to plans resulting from pressure of time.  Too many students to do more.

00:19:51		Primary responsibility of faculty honors committee.

00:20:30		Chairman's responsibility for adding new honors courses or protesting dropped courses.  English department example.

00:21:00		English department example concluded.

00:21:30		Bus and swimming pool conversations spawn new honors courses.  Mathematics, Spanish, Italian.  Professor Silvano Garofalo.

00:22:27		His teaching.  Psychological testing; personal psychology.  Reasons for giving it up.

00:24:05		Working with veterans.  Lee Dreyfus (governor) was allowed heavy credit loads.

00:26:14		Survey study of foreign students and faculty.  Survey Research Lab questionnaire—Harry P. Sharpe director.  Kinds of information solicited and tabulated.

00:29:05		CR's visit to most other schools with large foreign enrollments.  Schools listed.

00:29:56		Duration of project.  Conclusion, a 700-page report.

00:31:20		Report referred to Professor Edward E. Milligan, foreign student advisor.  Specific recommendations for program.  Help for Madison Friends of International Students.

00:32:45		UW program compared with that of other schools.

00:33:58		Carnegie grant to work with southern black universities.  Formation of the Committee on Cooperation with Negro (later "Developing") Universities.  CR first executive secretary, Jack Barbash first chairman.  The three schools worked with.

00:35:58		Upgrading faculties a main purpose.  Grants toward graduate degrees.
 
00:36:50		Money management involved.  Work with administrations of these southern colleges.  Computerizing libraries.
 
00:37:46		Teaching of English.  Cecil Patterson's cooperation at North Carolina Central University with UW English department.

00:38:05		Assessment of project's value.  Committee continuing.  CR's involvement—secretary, and chairman.  Joseph J. Corry.  Transfer of project to Extension.

00:38:50		UW faculty participation.  Visits south—a few days to a semester.  Upgrading departments for accreditation.  Example North Carolina A&T in engineering.

00:40:03		Committee membership.  Originally included R. Ralph Benedict, Max W. Carbon, Robert P. Niedermeier.

00:40:57		Disposition of CR's records for this project and the SOAR program.

00:42:20		CR's responsibilities in 1966 enumerated.  Giving up teaching.

00:43:07		Japanese universities institutes for student personal services.  American Council of Education appointed Wesley Lloyd, dean of students at Brigham Young University, to form a faculty to make a study.  Emphasis on personnel work.

00:44:29		Faculty members.  Gordon Klopf (UW), Leona Felsted (small college in Ohio), Morris Wolf (Kansas State University), Henry Ball (University of Minnesota).

00:45:18		Activities.  Three month institute for faculty and administration, on student personnel services.

00:45:42		Problems with student uprisings.  Protest causes.

00:46:44		Leaflets at Kyoto University.

00:47:32		Location of the institutes.  Visits to 80-90 other colleges and universities in Japan.  What discussed there.
 
00:48:23		Lectures and discussion groups, with interpreter.  Why few attending knew English.  Experience back at UW.

00:51:15		Reasons family couldn't go along.  Separation for a year.  Army quarters.

00:52:03		More on makeup of classes.  No student personnel work prior to WWII.

00:52:44		Resulting recommendations for changes.

00:53:45		Impact of the many Japanese students at U.S. universities after WWII.  UW a leading choice of Japanese students.  Professor Seighardt M. Riegel.

00:54:10		End of Tape 2

Tape 3

00:54:12		Never treated better than when in Japan. Never felt any animosity. Had a great experience over there. Still keeps in touch with his Japanese colleagues. It was a highlight of his UW experience.

00:56:40		Riots in early ‘60s led to the cancellation of a trip by Eisenhower to Japan. Zengakuren, a ultra-radical student group in Kyoto, gave them difficulties. They were advised to stay in the hotel at times.      

00:59:14		The SOAR program. New students and parents love the program 

01:00:36		Student Life and Higher Education (1953-63?): conferences or institutes sponsored by the council board of Associated Research Councils for foreign Fulbright scholars. These were one week conferences to bring Americans and foreign scholars together. Elizabeth Lam, Father Hessberg, Helen White, CR, and Bob Stroger helped set up these conferences. 

01:03:41		The conferences consisted of lectures and discussion groups, American and foreign students living and eating together. It was a good way to meet people outside their field and show them what higher education and student life was like. Gave foreign students a picture of American student life. 

01:06:37		Brittingham Viking Scholars/International Scholars. In 1953, Tom Brittingham Jr. sent a family friend to UW for a year. He was impressed with this student’s experience, so in 1954 he sent a group of Scandinavians (Viking Scholars) there. He tried selecting future leaders of their respective countries. He urged the students to join fraternities.

01:10:37		The program lasted until 1961, after a few years started another program, International Scholars. Brought in a group of women students. It wasn’t as elite of a group as the Viking Scholars, but they were better academically.

01:13:01		There was a significant difference in the backgrounds of the two groups. Vikings family owned Rubens and Cezanne paintings and lived in castles.  

01:16:03		Now that CR is retired he is thinking of writing a history of the honors program and possibly the history of L&S. The Woodrow Wilson Graduate Fellowships (mid-‘60s-’71), enabled graduating American college seniors to become college teachers. It was an elite fellowship. CR discusses the application process.

01:23:53		CR was a member of the Faculty Assembly, an organization that included representatives from all of the UW schools. It was an attempt for the schools to coordinate and share their experiences. It only lasted 7 years. CR served from ’67-’73.  A member had to be elected into the position. He was also part of the Faculty Senate from ‘70 to ‘74. He didn’t play an active role in the Faculty Senate or with the L&S Senate. He felt like more of an administrator than faculty member.

01:26:55		CR talks about Helen C. White and Jack Barbash. He had confidence in their decisions and took their sides on most issues. Helen White was one of his favorite people. Anecdote about Helen White.

01:29:10		CR was meticulous about getting somewhere on time. He learned from his father that if you’re a member of something, you should attend the meetings. He enjoyed his time in all of his various groups. CS liked faculty senate meetings better than normal faculty meetings. He felt it was disadvantageous that a student could drop a class 12 weeks into the semester.

01:34:12		CS discusses the minimum number of credits allowed for students.  If a student was in poor health, had family problems, or had to work, he/she could take less than 12 credits in a semester. He felt all students should have to take 12 credit loads because otherwise grade point averages were unfairly biased toward the students taking lighter loads. 
 
01:39:03		End of Second Interview Session

Third Interview Session (June 30, 1982): Digital File

Time			Keywords
00:00:00		Start of Interview

00:05:29		Probation vs. stiff probation vs. dropped action.  Lines of appeal.

00:06:44		Readmission after being dropped.

00:08:00		CR guesses small percentage (maybe 5%) of freshmen dropped.  Maybe 25-30% on probation.

00:09:05		Early admission requirements.  Six-weeks review.  Changed admission policy.  Responsibility of registrar's office re entering freshmen.  No quota for L&S.  Admission standards of elite schools—Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Chicago, etc.—compared with UW's.  UW standard in business, engineering higher than other UW schools of colleges.

00:13:07		ILS (Integrated Liberal Studies) students—somewhat separate entity.  Early teachers topnotch—Robert Pooley, Ray Agard, Lowell Noland.  Advantages for the students without a definite goal.

00:15:07		Many ILS students in the Honors Program.  Honors sections in ILS courses.  Herbert Howe's honors discussion section.

00:16:15		ILS students a bright group.  Impact of early ILS faculty compared with current ILS faculty.  Threat of dropping ILS.

00:18:21		American Association of University Professors (AAUP) membership CR never in leadership role.  Special AAUP category for administrators.
			
00:20:36		End of Tape 3

(Tape 4)

00:20:37		CR's view of AAUP on the Madison campus.  Distinguished for national organization presidents—Mark Ingraham, Helen White, David Fellman.  National policies.

00:22:21		Ability of academic departments to determine policies and procedures facilitated interdepartmental programs.  Area study programs: French, Ibero-American, Afro-American, East Asian, etc.

00:26:17		Institute for Environmental Studies (IES).  Courses from different colleges and departments under one program.  No major.  Certificate awarded.

00:28:12		Biology Core Curriculum.  L&S, Agriculture College, Medical School combined program—four tough courses in biology.

00:30:59		Junior year abroad.  Language prerequisite.  Countries having these programs.  Difficulties for some science students.

00:33:49		Directed study (reading) courses.  Individual arrangement with professor for upperclassmen.  New plan allows freshmen and sophomores to take similar, #199 courses.

00:36:20		Credit by examination, College Board program for advanced placement courses in high school, with special exams.  UW faculty approval slow.

00:38:48		College Level Examination Program (CLEP).  National program.  Eligibility for test.

00:40:29		Discussion of language requirement.  Changes.

00:43:08		Pass-fail grades.  Origin.  Pros and cons.  Comment of James Watrous' course in art history.

00:47:38		CR's advice on courses to his son—art history from Watrous, classics from Herbert Hoe, history from Michael Petrovich.  Elect professors rather than subjects.  Advising students on the good teachers.

00:50:45		Career advising.  L&S relied on Career Advising and Placement Office—Emily Chervenik former director.  Program planning.  Engineering, Business, Journalism with their own placement offices.  Advising L&S majors.

00:52:57		Placing history, philosophy, English, etc., majors in jobs.  A future for psychology students.

00:54:55		Argument for a liberal arts education.  Limitations of choosing a major early.  Engineering example.

00:58:16		Awards selection committees.  Deans Prize—requirements.

01:00:19		Helen White Award.  Selection process.

01:01:50		Troxell Award for junior and senior women.  Group interviews.

01:03:34		Abraham Burack Award, for female honors student taking junior year abroad.

01:04:48		More on Knapp And Trewartha grants.

01:05:30		Phi Beta Kappa selection in L&S.

01:06:10		Selection of members of awards committees.

01:07:57		The Personnel Council (early '40s).  Started by Assistant Dean of Men William Blaesser.  Beginning of personnel work at UW.  Lapse during WWII.

01:10:14		1951 beginning of informal meetings by assistant and associate deans ("working deans").  Kenneth Little chairman.  Became the Junior Administrative Council (1954-63)—still informal.  Superseded 1963 by Associate Administrative Committee, appointed by the president.  Membership.  Matters worked on.

01:15:04		Committee on Student Conduct and Appeals.  Offenses varied widely.  Anecdote.  Makeup of committee.  Ken Little (sometimes Bill Thomas), Ted Zillman, Louise Troxell, Ruedisili or Vincent Kivlin, at one time.  Procedure and disciplinary actions.  Appeal.

01:19:30		Difference between disciplinary probation and academic probation.

01:20:40		Taking attendance; cutting classes.

01:21:23		ROTC requirement.  Faculty committee on exemptions.  Committee membership—Ted Zillman on as dead of men, faculty member Harold Groves.  Procedure.  Acceptable grounds and evidence for exemption.  1962 rule change.

01:24:55		Men's Halls Faculty Committee.  Selection of house fellows.  Interviews.

01:26:20		High-rise dorms—Chadbourne, Witte, Sellery.  Opposition to them.  Adams, Tripp, Kronshage, Liz Waters types not economical.

01:27:07		End of Tape 4

Tape 5

01:27:07		Reasons for opposition to high rises.

01:27:53		Naming the new buildings and the different floors within them.  Number of floors per house fellow.

01:28:39		House fellow's jobs and influence.  Changes in house regulations.  Roles of head resident, and of administrative head of residence halls.  Newell Smith, Larry Halle, Paul Ginsberg.

01:31:49		Public Functions Committee.  Prime responsibilities—honorary degree convocation, commencement ceremony.  Henry Ahlgren, George W. Washa as chairmen.  Rain contingency.  Ed Young's expedient.  Arrangement intricacies.  Protest complications.

01:35:53		Issue over the Invocation and Benediction, pushed by student Ann L. Gaylor.  Dave Fellman's view re the Constitution.  Precedents for them.  CR resigned from the committee over dropping them.  Reasons.

01:38:40		Resignation as commencement marshal.  Marshal's job.  CR's work with the PhD candidates.  Candidates' names.

01:41:20		Registration and Records Committee.  Joseph J. Corry chairman.  Registration procedures; record keeping.  Worked toward computerization.  Advance registration process and problems.

01:44:57		Assignment Committee procedure re sections.  Examples in psychology, math.  Its merit; student objections.  The Armory.

01:46:51		CR as building custodian for South Hall, 1949-80.  Responsibilities.  Determine building custodians.

01:50:00		Relations with regents.  Anecdote about one regent's pressure re student.  Ingraham settled the matter finally.

01:53:06		Contacts with presidents.  Incident with Dykstra and the student with a gun.  Role of Julia Wilkinson and Annette Washburn on this occasion.

01:58:05		CR's major disappointments.  Inadequate appreciation of lower echelon of administrative work—assistant and associate deans.  Comparison with faculty.

01:59:10		Level of recognition of assistant and associate deans.  Importance of functions not recognized by some presidents, chancellors, deans.

02:00:32      Only other regret, as mentioned—loss of honors office.

02:01:13		End of Third Interview Session

Fourth Interview Session (July 7, 1982): Digital File

Time		Keywords
00:00:00		Start of Interview

00:00:01		Anecdote.  The mother with the wide brimmed hat.

00:02:45		Anecdote.  Threat by student of a punch in the nose.

00:04:49		Anecdote.  Farrington Daniels at Commencement.

00:06:56		Retirement activities.  Badger Bonsai Society.

00:10:33		Retired faculty programs.  Emeriti Brunch.  New Meetings added.  Jac B. Garner speaking on retirement benefits, legislation.  CR on committee for the coming year.

00:12:37		Location of fall, winter session.  Parking.  Possibility of Brittingham home.

00:13:39		Committee members this year; George Washa chairman, M. Leslie Holt, Nellie R. McCannon, and two others he can't remember.  Role of Peter Bunn.  Kathryn R. Beach new chairman.

00:15:18		Cruise in 1955, as University representative for the NROTC (navy).  Six weeks on U.S.S. Wisconsin.  Preparations for firing 16-inch guns—wrapping up glass.  Photographing gun going off.  Joke on him.

00:19:55		On individual students.  First, Jeffrey R. M. Kunz.  Prediction he will return to Madison in some capacity some day, and why.

00:22:11		Other students.  John D. McKinlay and his stutter.  Matt J. Kust.  Cy Butts—State Street character and perpetual student.  Cyrus M. Butts' Experimental College records.

00:28:11		Identification of interview.

00:28:49		End of Fourth Interview Session

SECOND INTERVIEW

First Interview Session (March 12, 1993): Digital File

Time		Keywords
00:00:00		Start of Interview [begin Tape 6]

00:02:10		CR describes the feeling on campus before the war began.  He was busy with graduate work and therefore did not think much about the war before it started.  He got his Ph.D. in 1941.  Just prior to war breaking out, the University made some preparations.  President Clarence Dykstra formed the Personnel Council, which regularly brought deans and faculty advisors together to prepare materials for counseling students about to go off to war.  He mentions some members of the Council.

00:05:02		CR remembers Pearl Harbor Day on campus.  It was a Sunday afternoon, and he was preparing a lecture at home when he heard the announcement.  Within a week, Dykstra called a student convocation.  Things changed on campus.  Servicemen soon showed up—in 1942, the Navy in particular was sending its men to UW.  Also, the sex ratio changed.  In the mid and later war years, there were two women for every non-serviceman on campus.  Women played a more important role.  The tremendous influx of military personnel started in late 1942 and 1943.  By that time, many students had enlisted, especially athletes like Elroy Hirsch.

00:10:30		At the time, CR was assistant dean of L&S.  His main function, other than teaching, was to offer counseling to male students about the draft and serving in the military.  He tried to prepare them mentally for what would happen, the best chances for taking advantage of their skills, etc.  For the new soldiers, the first step was induction at an induction center in Milwaukee.  Then they were sent to a reception center at Camp Grant, where they were tested and interviewed.  Most students waited to be drafted rather than enlisting, as their chances of getting into a desirable job in the service was just as good.  The Army did a good job of classifying men and making use of their skills.

00:15:22		CR gives some examples of UW students who were drafted and tells what happened to them.  One of his students, Matt Kust, enlisted in the Navy, where he learned German through correspondence.  After the war, Kust got his Ph.D. and became a well-known professor and international economist.  CR's brother-in-law Earl went in as a bugler, but subsequently got into personnel work and became an interviewer.  Earl was his best source of information about the services.  John McKinley, an advisee in the dean's office, managed to get rid of his stutter while in service.  David Schreiner—a UW football player, all-American end, and a wonderful person—was killed on Iwo Jima.  It was a blow to all of Madison and the University.

00:20:29		CR discusses military programs on campus.  The Army Specialized Training Program was an L&S program academically directed by N. Leslie Holt.  The look of campus changed.  The University was short of buildings, and all possible space was used; for instance, fraternity houses were used to house servicemen.  Temporary buildings were erected, including Quonset huts.  The biggest one was used as a reading room for the old Historical Library.

00:23:36		Patriotism ran high on campus during WWII.  There was no conflict between the servicemen and civilians.  Times were tough, and there was rationing.  CR relates an anecdote concerning his ration books.  There was not much anti-German sentiment like in WWI, when the Milwaukee schools stopped teaching German.  The opposition was not to the German people, but rather to Hitler and the Nazis.  Men were especially interested in taking the two courses CR offered in psychological testing and personnel, since he related information that was of value to them after they went into the army.  

00:31:25		CR talks about Dykstra's involvement during the war years.  It was through Dykstra's efforts that the Personnel Council was formed at UW.  It was an outstanding program.  He eventually headed the Selective Service.  He left UW after the war to go to California.  Two years of military science was required of male students, but this requirement was abolished after war.

00:33:53		Besides his teaching and counseling responsibilities, CR also did testing of Navy radio communications trainees.  Several small programs came to campus during the war, such as the Cooks' and Bakers' School run by Residence Halls.  He was involved with two such training programs, serving as an academic advisor for placing the students in appropriate L&S courses for additional training:  1) the Pratt Whitney Aircraft Training program for women; and 2) the Air Force Meteorology program.  Many UW faculty members went to Washington, were involved in government research projects, or enlisted as officers during the war.  The University made a big contribution to the war effort in many ways.

00:39:47		WHA surely played an important role during the war, as there was no television.  CR remembers the death of President Franklin D. Roosevelt.  He did a great job as a war president.  CR talks about the reaction to Harry S. Truman and the dropping of the atomic bomb.  He considers Truman one of the great U.S. presidents.  People were glad the war was over, but were saddened at the death toll.  CR saw the destruction in Hiroshima first-hand when he spent a year in Japan in 1951/52 working with Japanese universities.

00:45:50		Returning veterans were the best students CR had in all his years of teaching.  They were anxious to finish their education.  He remembers Lee Dreyfus, later governor, as one of them.

00:47:54		End of First Interview Session

END of Interview #225