UNIVERSITY OF WISCONSIN ARCHIVES
ORAL HISTORY PROJECT

Interview #293
EVERSON, GEORGE F.

EVERSON, George F. (1912- )
Undergraduate Student; Director of Business Services
At UW: 1938-1941; 1948-1984

Interviewed: 1984		
Interviewer: Laura Smail
Length: 1.5 hours
Transcript: 57 pages

Background; Business office; Payroll and budget before computers; Research administration; Business office personalities; Development of data processing; Recent use of computer for word processing; Development of new accounting system in 1970s; Cooperation with personnel office about budget data; Merger; UW and central administration business offices; Advantages of centralized payroll for System; Issue of public access to information; Student protest era; Effort to spread out nine-month salaries over year; Early retirement.

Tape 1/Side 1

00:00:27	Background.  Father ill, mother had to work.  Father a painter and paper hanger.  Had one brother.  Parents hadn't gone to college.  GE was valedictorian of class so got scholarship to come to UW.  Had very high grades.  Had good teachers.  Liked all his subjects.  Enjoyed business course.  Had decided to go into accounting.

00:03:31	Scholarship just took care of semester fees.  Commuted from home, sometimes by car, sometimes by train.  Had jobs in high school--NYA projects and other jobs.  Ill in 1941.  Then drafted.

00:04:50	After war, had some laboring jobs; realized wanted to go back to college.

00:05:16	Wanted to be in area.  Applied for a variety of jobs.  Hit it off well with Cafferty, who offered him a job.

00:06:27	Began living in Madison in 1950 when was married.

00:06:44	The business office.  Describes the building.  The relief on moving into the Peterson Building.  Soon filled it up.

00:08:45	Worked in payroll area first.  Just beginning to put payroll on computer cards.  Ralph Martens.  Still working.  Eunice Schultz used to type them on a bookkeeping machine.  Staff didn't increase much even when enrollment went up.  When budget done on adding machines, everyone who could work an adding machine was put to work in spring when budget being prepared--Memorial Day to 4th of July.  Weekends, too.  The adding machine tape would run from the first floor to the second floor.  Then assembling the pages of the budget--walking around the table.  Everyone pitched in.  Was fun.

00:13:00	GE had nothing to do with decisions re budget, just the putting together of it.

00:13:32	Had nothing to do with computerization of business office.

00:14:22	Began working on gifts and grants in mid-fifties.  An area of enormous growth.  Were able to add to staff.  Len Van Ess took over when GE moved out.  Was an excellent organizer.

00:16:05	Research Administration financial office. Describes how it worked.  In the beginning could pare indirect costs if agency short of funds but later became too important a source of University income.  The change to modified total direct costs, demanded by government.  More general discussion.

00:23:06	Didn't usually get to know grant applicants.  Some he did.  A few prima donnas.  The fixed price contracts.

00:25:13	Questions about the use of overhead.  Supported operating budget, in part, but the "special capital exercise" could be used by other campuses.

00:29:29	End of side.

Tape 1/Side 2

00:29:31	Questions re 1962 reorganization of business office by regents.  Didn't affect GE.

00:30:42	Question re people he worked for.  The greater casualness then.  Cafferty could say, "Let's go to the baseball game".  More on Cafferty.  A story about losing his temper with some federal auditors.  Liesl Tarkow was involved; pacified them.  Lorenz a wonderful person to work for.  Never a harsh word.  Brilliant guy, too.

00:34:28	Some people GE worked with.  Knew Peterson, but was aloof.  Colorful people in data processing.  "You couldn't live with them; you couldn't live without them", they used to say.  Area developed so fast.  Had to.  Reports required from all segments of state and federal government, and University had to put resources into computing.  Ted Wiese.  Big fellow, not too bad to work with.  Zeke Torzewski, intense guy, paced the office, sent GE up the wall.  Dick Hughes.  The two sides--the shop that took care of registrar matters, i.e. academic affairs, and the shop that took care of payroll.  The merging was traumatic.  Two directors, one had to go.  Jack Duwe, now director, was once a trainee in business office.  The merging took place in mid or late seventies.  The move from hand work to deck of cards was wonderful.  GE didn't use it directly, other than to sort cards at time when he was handling payroll.  Developed strong hands.  Today it's unbelievable the progress.  In last three or four years began using computer for word processing.  Don Miner replaced GE, put this through.  Hadn't cut staff.  GE still finds it intimidating--working with a computer.  Ways word processing has helped.  Decision to get Wang.

00:47:20	Question how they trained people.  Payroll wanted to do it immediately.  Purchasing resisted it; in last three years began to automate.  Question re estimate that a requisition costs $22 to process.  Probably conservative.  But when computerized will go faster.  Duplication.  In the 1960s, GE resisted automation.  Thought it was going too fast.  Didn't trust gadgetry.

00:52:14	Question re GE's developing of accounting system during seventies.  Says Ralph Martens should get the credit.  A genius.  And people in Administrative Data Processing.  Bill Kenyon another person who pushed it.  Went into business for himself, computer business.  The accounting system evolved.  Eventually, could send monthly reports to dean's office.  Lots of information if they'll read it.  Example, department might want to know how much it spends for chemicals, postage.  Can find out.  Classified salaries another example; easy to get breakdown now.  Every federal grant has its own account; every gift. Now you can get it through cathode ray terminal, record a transfer, have it appear instantly.

00:57:10	End of side. End of tape.

Tape 2/Side 1

00:57:20	Had sent reports to departments earlier, but not as helpful.  Once did a survey of what federal accounting offices would like to see.  Surprised at number of suggestions.  Accounting office offers to explain reports.  Gives an example of an EEOC report they used to send.  Weren't following the fine print as to what was required; had to change.  Have become outlandishly complicated.  Without computer could never do it.  GE worked closely with Cyrena Pondrom in connection with her personnel data.  Very closely related to budget data.  Historical data on employees not yet well organized.  Recent effort to join the two efforts.  Very expensive.  Takes time to design a system.  Can't measure time spent on it.  Glenn Watts, Mary Yodelis Smith, Dick Laufenberg, Ralph Martens are people who can work together.  Names Peterson, Cafferty, Lorenz as people who have made things go.  And the current group mentioned above.

01:09:13	Question re link with Graduate School.

01:12:07	Question re merger.  Business people were nervous about their jobs.  GE had been controller in Central Administration.  Was then put under Madison Campus.  Thinks everyone was absorbed.  GE's loyalty was to Madison campus.  Continued to handle some affairs of Milwaukee, Parkside, Green Bay.  Milwaukee began handling own extramural support affairs.  Didn't take any of experienced people from Madison to help.  Discusses responsibilities of Madison Campus and Central Administration business offices.  They exchange information.  Why have two processing centers?  Studied, but not changed.  In payroll area would make sense.  Discusses. 

01:22:27	Question re contact with legislature.  Little.  Sometimes they'll call for information, but not a good idea to give out much in isolation.  Examples calls about purchases, inspired by unhappy vendors.  Get calls from newspapers.  Would refer to new service.  But if wanted to see records, could since most are public.  Recalls Bob Cohen coming in and wanting to see Math Research Center contract.  Lorenz handled it; he was allowed to.

01:26:24	End of side.

Tape 2/Side 2

01:26:29	Difficulty of public record law is getting facts in isolation.  An example of a medical school couple traveling first class.  Everson consulted Bob Borchers; both got mentioned in an unpleasant news story.

01:29:18	Story about a protest-era encounter.  His feelings about it.

01:32:55	Encounters with faculty.  Not frequent except for people brought on to chancellor's staff--Cyrena Pondrom.  She consulted him as to whom she should make head of data processing.  GE recommended Jack Duwe, whom she was already considering. 

01:34:57	GE didn't join University Club.  Liked to separate his personal and work life.  Has been active in his church.

01:36:23	A task force having to do with people on 9-month salaries wanting income spread over 12 months.  GE forestalled having it done in University.  Credit Union took it over.  Lorenz appointed GE. John Ross was faculty representative.  [LS reads statement about Everson made by John Ross prior to interview.]  GE's comments.  Doesn't think he made whole thing work.  One person can't do that.  Names some of those who have shared the responsibility.

01:42:20	Why GE retired so early.  Healthy, largely.  Also, tired.  What he's been doing.  Hard to learn to loaf.  Better relationship with wife.  He benefitted from some changes in retirement system.

01:47:36	End of tape. End of interview.
END