UNIVERSITY OF WISCONSIN-MADISON ARCHIVES
ORAL HISTORY PROJECT

Interview #730
ELDER, JOSEPH

ELDER, Joseph (1930- )
Professor, Department of Sociology and Department of Languages and Cultures of Asia
At UW: 1961-

Interviewed: 2005	
Interviewer: Robert Lange
Length: 7 hours

Family history; Childhood; Recollections of Second World War; Oberlin College; Teaching in India; Harvard University; Research and medical activities in India; Quakerism; UW Department of Sociology; Study abroad program; Documentary films; Teaching; Center for South Asian Studies; American Institute of Indian Studies (AIIS); Committee service; Grants; Peace movement during Vietnam War; Advocacy of issues concerning gays, lesbians, bisexuals, and transgenders; Higher education.

First Interview Session (October 10, 2005): Tapes 1-3

Tape 1/Side 1

00:00:27	Joseph Elder was born in 1930 to a missionary family.  His father worked in Russia and Armenia before marrying.  His father and mother worked in Iran.  JE was born in Iran and spent his early childhood in Kurdish territory.

00:03:31	First memories of his family’s compound.

00:05:00	His family went to New Jersey shortly before returning to Iran in 1938.  He recalls traveling through Nazi Germany.

00:05:50	World War II in Iran and disruptions: bread riots, typhus outbreaks.

00:10:07	Friendship with American GIs; Roosevelt’s visit to Tehran. His family left Iran after the war and lived in New Jersey.

00:15:12	JE attended boarding school in Massachusetts while his parents returned to Iran. His siblings’ college education.  

00:17:48	JE planned to attend Hanover College in Indiana but his assistant headmaster encouraged him to apply to Oberlin College.  Oberlin offered him a full scholarship.

00:19:49	He talks about his education at Oberlin.  History course from Harvey Goldberg.

00:23:31	JE majored in sociology. Extracurricular activities. Oberlin Shansi Memorial Association. 

00:25:46	He applied to go to China through a memorial program founded by Oberlin, but was diverted to a school in South India to teach English.

00:27:05	He taught in India for two years.  Experiences in India.  Fascination with kinship structures in India.

00:30:39	End of side.

Tape 1/Side 2

00:30:51	Joseph Elder continues to talk about his teaching in India.

00:32:43	He gathered material for a master’s thesis on caste in the Protestant Christian community.

00:34:16	His wife researched attitudes toward marriage among high school girls.

00:34:56	They returned to Oberlin for a year. He and his wife had their first child in India.  

00:39:33	JE attended Harvard University for sociology and was funded through the Ford Foundation’s Foreign Area Fellowship Training Program. Talcott Parsons.

00:42:06	Discussion of Cornell. Wide study in behavioral sciences.  He talks about his graduate education at Harvard.

00:45:20 	His study with Parsons.

00:52:00	JE describes his dissertation on the impact of a large sugar factory on a small village in India.  He also talks about living in the caste system while conducting his research there.  Friendship with an “untouchable.”

01:00:13	His wife Joann home-schooled their children in India.

01:01:31	End of side.  End of tape.

Tape 2/Side 1

00:00:10	Joseph Elder continues to describe living with his family in India while researching his dissertation.  Anecdotes about his work as an amateur doctor.

00:12:14	The Ford Foundation heard about his medical activities and asked him to desist but he continued.

00:14:23	His role as a doctor endeared him to villagers and facilitated his research.

00:15:04	JE describes his research method.

00:17:09	Return to Harvard. Conversations with veterans of the Second World War contributed to JE’s decision to apply as a conscientious objector during the Korean War.

00:26:21	He and his wife “drifted” toward Quakerism and formally became Quakers while they were graduate students at Oberlin.

00:30:47	End of side.

Tape 2/Side 2

00:30:57	Joseph Elder continues to talk about the evolution of his religious beliefs.

00:35:26	After receiving his PhD in 1959, JE took a job at Oberlin to teach sociological theory as well as courses on India.  He talks about preparing lectures.

00:42:13	Henry Hart from the University of Wisconsin department of political science recruited him to become part of the South Asian Studies program.  

00:46:35	JE explains why UW was a national leader in developing new programs such as South Asian Studies.  He thinks administrative leadership, especially on the part of Fred H. Harrington, played a key role.

00:50:16	He completed his two-year contract at Oberlin before coming to UW in summer 1961.

00:51:20	In the summer of 1961 he participated in a faculty seminar on nationalism.  His appointment was two-thirds in sociology and one-third in the department of Indian studies.

00:54:14	Study Abroad Program. JE went to India to check on five students who had been sent there through the university’s study abroad program.  He talks about his trip to India the following year.

01:01:42	End of side.  End of tape.

Tape 3/Side 1

00:00:10	Joseph Elder continues to talk about the development of a study abroad program in India.

00:02:49	Diplomatic relations between the US and India in 1972 prohibited students from traveling there.

00:05:54	The program reopened in 1973-4 with graduate student monitors traveling with the students.  Current changes in the study abroad program will employ Indian faculty.

00:10:28	JE describes some of the most successful students, including Diana Eck.

00:16:32	Disciplinary incident involving a student.

00:22:15	Expansion of the study abroad program to Nepal.  Closure of the campus in Kathmandu in 2005.

00:30:39	End of side.

Second Interview Session (October 11, 2005): Tapes 3-5

Tape 3/Side 2

00:30:52	Joseph Elder continues to describe the study abroad program in India.  Sources of funding.  Competition for Fulbright-Hays funds.

00:40:22	Pressure to publish.  He edited a collection of lecture outlines and chapters on Indian history and society.  

00:45:24	Progress toward tenure.  He had difficulty in preparing his dissertation for publication and opted not to do so because of problems with several chapters.  Other publications.

00:55:50	JE collaborated with one of his students in making documentary films.

01:01:33	End of side.  End of tape.

Tape 4/Side 1

00:00:10	Joseph Elder continues to discuss the documentary films on which he collaborated with one of his students.  Funding sources.  Disruption by warfare.

00:05:12	JE describes the content of the films.

00:09:07	Use and format of films. Funding for the films.

00:10:01	His students shot most of the films.  More recent films on which he has worked were shot by an Indian filmmaker.

00:15:07	JE taught two sociological theory courses when he first came to UW.

00:16:34	In the early 1970s he developed a graduate course on the sociology of economic change, which focused on developing countries.  The National Institute of Mental Health funded a training program for people to collect census data in areas on which there was little information–such as Tanzania, Yugoslavia, and Nepal.  JE took a group to do a study of land settlement in Nepal.

00:18:49	For South Asian Studies, JE taught an introductory course on the civilizations of India. Course on the social structure of India.

00:24:06	Course on Gandhi. 

00:26:06	The hostage crisis in Iran provided the impetus for the development of a third specialty course on the social structure of Muslim societies.

00:29:08	JE describes plans to improve the sociology department under chair Russ Middleton. 

0030:34	End of side.

Tape 4/Side 2

00:30:44	Joseph Elder talks about the UW sociology department.  Chair Russ Middleton reduced the teaching load and placed emphasis on recruiting high-quality faculty.  Students were required to take more methods and statistics courses.

00:35:28	When JE arrived at UW the department was “young” and there were no “turf battles” among faculty.

00:37:11	Deans were supportive of the rebuilding of the sociology department.

00:39:10	Some outstanding graduate students in sociology.

00:41:25	JE describes the organization of the South Asian Studies program.  Links to the American Institute of Indian Studies.

00:46:00	Development of Department of Indian Studies into a Department of South Asian Studies and recently into a Department of Languages and Cultures of Asia.

00:49:30	JE chaired the Department of Indian Studies in 1965.  The following year he traveled on a mission with two English Quakers to India and Pakistan in the aftermath of a war between the two nations.

00:56:05	JE spent 1966-67 at the Center for Advanced Studies at Wesleyan University.

00:59:05	Pressure came from the Education Department in Washington to separate the department from the South Asian Center and for the Center to do more outreach activity.  JE was director of the Center from 1990 until 2002.

01:01:24	End of side.  End of tape.

Tape 5/Side 1

00:00:12	Joseph Elder continues to discuss his tenure as director of the Center for South Asian Studies.  Challenge of government cutbacks in funding.  The Center at UW remained strong through the prominence of its alumni and the vitality of its study abroad and film-making programs.

00:03:33	Federal funding has revived with the prominence of terrorism.

00:04:46	Trends in student enrollment in South Asian Studies.  Popularity of Hindi.

00:05:55	History of the American Institute of Indian Studies (AIIS).  JE was elected president of the AIIS and served for eight years.  Funding difficulties were overcome by developing an endowment.  

00:16:52	JE describes a colleague in the AIIS.

00:21:54	He was editor-in-chief for an AIIS book that assembled chapters on how the study of India transformed American scholars’ methods.

00:26:22	JE talks about his committee service for the University of Wisconsin.  He chaired a committee to deal with signs on the campus.  Redrawing of the campus map.

00:29:48	He dislikes campus politics and never served on the Faculty Senate.  Executive committee for the Land Tenure Center and the Development Studies PhD program.

00:30:28	He was elected to the Social Studies Divisional Committee.

00:30:40	End of side.

Tape 5/Side 2

00:30:52	Joseph Elder describes his service on the Social Studies Divisional Committee from 1972 to 1975.  Review of candidates for tenure.

00:38:26	He served on the Academic Planning Committee in 1982-84 and 1992-95.

00:41:49	JE comments on his relationship with deans and administrators at the university. 

00:49:28	He talks about Donna Shalala.

00:52:10	He talks about collaborating with Shalala on investigating discrimination based on sexual orientation.

00:59:09	Impressions of Shalala as chancellor.

01:01:24	End of side.  End of tape.

Third Interview Session (October 17, 2005): Tapes 6-7

Tape 6/Side 1

00:00:33	Joseph Elder discusses numerous grants he has received, such as those for the study abroad program in India.

00:02:29	Funding for documentary film projects.

00:03:22	JE supervised funding applications during his presidency of the American Institute of Indian Studies (AIIS).

00:05:16	Private sources of funding from the Ford Foundation and the Mellon Foundation.

00:07:53	JE assesses the prospects for future funding from the Office of Education.  Terrorism has prompted more money to become available for the study of South Asian languages.

00:11:47	His wife, Joann, worked as an undergraduate advisor in the sociology department.  There is also a scholarship in her name.  She helped organized the Academic Staff Association on campus.  Her work for the School Board.

00:19:54	JE describes the visit of the Dalai Lama.

00:30:36	End of side.

Tape 6/Side 2

00:30:46	Joseph Elder continues to talk about the Dalai Lama.

00:32:51	He describes his activities in the peace movement during the Vietnam War through the American Friends Service Committee.  JE became a link between the Quakers in Philadelphia and the North Vietnamese government to transfer medical and school supplies to civilians.  He describes meeting with Henry Kissinger and talks about his involvement in issues such as violence against civilians and prisoners of war.

00:52:24	Press publicity for his work in North Vietnam.

00:54:10	JE discusses campus activism at UW, the Sterling Hall bombing, and his teaching arrangements during the protest era.

00:59:31	He describes the work of Madison Quakers Inc. in Vietnam.

01:01:25	End of side.  End of tape.

Tape 7/Side 1

00:00:10	Joseph Elder describes the My Lai massacre in Vietnam.

00:02:57	JE also worked for the Quakers regarding Bangladesh and in Sri Lanka carrying messages between the government and the Tamil Tigers.  He spoke at a memorial service following terrorist attacks on the US in September 2001.  He reads from his statement.

00:09:38	JE talks about his advocacy for gay, lesbian, and bisexual students.  ROTC case on campus.

00:23:16	He teaches a course on gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender studies.  JE speculates as to why there are not more courses offered on these subjects.

00:28:07	He talks about generational differences in attitudes toward homosexuality.

00:30:38	End of side.  

Tape 7/Side 2

00:30:53	Joseph Elder reflects on changes in the quality of students at UW during his career.  He comments on idealism among students.

00:35:21	Role of higher education and the need for intellectuals.  JE describes some of his lecturing and public speaking activities, including lectures for the Foreign Service Institute.

00:46:08	End of side.  End of tape.  End of interview.

END