UNIVERSITY OF WISCONSIN MADISON ARCHIVES
ORAL HISTORY PROJECT

Interview #371
LEHMAN, JOHN W.

LEHMAN, John W. (1910- )
Undergraduate Student
At UW: 1927-1928; 1929-1932

Interviewed: 1984	
Interviewer: Mailed questionnaire
Length: 1.5 hours

Undergraduate and graduate experience at UW; Registration; Professors and courses; Residence halls and off-campus housing; Financing education; Sports; Clubs and organizations; Daily Cardinal and Octopus; Student attitudes; Radicalism; Campus personalities; Lower State Street and Square; Co-op, shops and restaurants; State Street merchants; Effects of Depression and job market after graduation; New Deal, Federal Emergency Relief Administration and positions with Federal Emergency Relief Administration and Agricultural Administration; Employment as economist for Tennessee Valley Authority; Social Security Act; Career goals.  

Tape 1/Side 1

00:000:00	Name and address.

00:00:12	Attended UW 1927-28, 1929-32; had graduated from Sparta High School; assumed he would attend college.  His father taught at the UW Engineering College; his mother graduated from Valparaiso University.

00:00:57	JL had no specific career goal, wanted a worthwhile job.

00:01:14	No orientation program at UW or perhaps JL didn't participate.  Needed more help from advisor regarding elective classes.

00:01:39	Horrendous registration process.

00:02:02	Once JL almost gave up school because of registration process.

00:02:19	Transferred to University of Illinois to pursue architecture degree.  Had romantic notion of combining imagination with skill of engineering in the form of architectural career.

00:02:48	JL didn't know that to be a good architect had to be a good freehand drawer.  He came back to UW after one year at Illinois.

00:03:09	Major: W. Beard Taylor taught a Corporation Finance course on investments and was major professor for JL's graduate year.  (JL puzzled that Taylor wasn't on his faculty list.)

00:03:37	Shepard School of Accounting--maybe Taylor was a faculty member of this school.

00:03:57	Major as graduate student: Corporation Finance.  Major as undergraduate student: Public Utility.

00:04:15	W. Beard Taylor a natural teacher.  Taylor had come to UW at time Burley and Maines had written Corporation and Private Property.

00:05:04	W. Beard Taylor had long career at University of Redlands, California.

00:05:10	Professor Commons had Friday night discussions at his home, Socratic Method.

00:05:36	Professor Commons taught Institutional Economics; in Commons' introduction to Institutional Economics course he talked about the Scottish philosopher Hume; labor economics.

00:06:31	Professor Peakover was pompous, stuffy; each year he produced new volume of outlines to accompany textbook--Peakover a lecturer, not a teacher. 

00:07:30	Professor Scott was elderly, taught History of Economic Thought course; Scott had a unique teaching schedule; JL was scared of him; Scott had written a textbook on money and banking; crotchety personality.

00:09:17	Professor Glaeser was a gentle person, excellent scholar, good teacher; a Utility Economics professor; consultant to government: embodied principle of Wisconsin idea where faculty made itself available to state legislature and government.

00:10:12	Harry Jerome a statistics professor, an excellent lecturer, chair of department.

00:10:28	Phil Fox an excellent instructor, became statistics professor at University of Iowa.

00:10:47	Jerome brought out beauty of good mathematical solution.

00:11:01	Margaret Pryor was a pioneer in Consumer Economics before it was recognized as a field of study; she taught from real life; she taught what was probably the first course in Consumer Economics in the US.

00:11:58	Harold Groves taught taxation; he epitomized the Wisconsin idea, served state and legislature well in tax design impact.  Groves made better citizens of students.

00:12:34	As staff member of Joint Economic Committee of Congress, JL invited to Groves to be a panel member of a discussion about future taxes in US.

00:12:54	Groves as athlete.

00:13:08	Professor Trumbower plodded through Transportation Economics--not an exciting class; Trumbower a good journeyman professor; always available for administrative chores.

00:13:58	Department strong in public utilities, public finance, corporate finance, history of economic thought, consumer economics, but weak in theory after Richard Ely left faculty.

00:14:21	Public Utilities, Public Finance, and Consumer Economics were JL's favorite courses.

00:14:40	Outside of Economics, Harry Hayden Clark's American Literature class was JL's favorite.

00:15:18	In JL's favorite classes there was an underlying feeling that instructors really knew the material.  All the great professors were skilled in use of language.

00:15:52	Lived in a residence hall for one and a half years, the house fellow was Charles Furst.

00:17:02	At the evening meal there was no dress rules, the food was served by waiters--family style, desserts.  Breakfast was served cafeteria style, no prayer.  Good food.

00:17:57	House rules: doesn't remember.

00:18:17	Off campus housing.

00:18:36	At Illinois, JL belonged to an architectural fraternity.

00:18:54	JL lived at two different rooming houses: one next to Ann Emery, other had in conjunction a boarding house.  Also lived in a bachelor apartment and in a private home.

00:20:36	The bachelor apartment building was on a short street parallel to Langdon Street; the apartment was a single room with a private bath; could bring home members of the opposite sex, surreptitiously.

00:21:35	Religion: freshman year sang in choir of Methodist Church on West Washington; later sang in Congregational Church on Breese Terrace--JL had grown up in Congregational Church, splendid choir, minister was Alfred Swan who later became national secretary for the Congregational Church; attended meetings at Newman House (a campus religious house).

00:23:25	Spectator sports on campus: football, basketball, track, crew, baseball.

00:23:37	JL played freshman hockey, coach was Art Thompson who also coached swim team.  Thompson came to Madison from Milwaukee Athletic Club where he was a teammate of Ching Johnson and Taffy Abel (hockey); Abel and Johnson later played for New York Rangers.  Thompson a patient coach.

00:25:09	Varsity played in 6-team league.

00:25:38	Meiklejohn brothers (2) were outstanding players; one of the Patricks, a coach of Kansas City Blues, said that Gordy Meiklejohn (played at McGill University) was good enough to play pro hockey; their father worked with Experimental College.

00:26:37	JL played in mixed double tennis tournament; Tony Turnjack, captain of varsity tennis.

00:27:08	Semifinals:  JL and partner beat member of varsity and his partner--highlight of his tennis career.  Lost in finals to Frank Parker and partner, Parker also played on varsity (this isn't the Parker of Davis Cup fame), Parker won National Public Parks Tournament in Minneapolis;  Cardinal picture.

00:28:16	JL's education financed by family and his own summer earnings.  Had a job as draftsman making soil maps for Bayfield County through the Agricultural Department; College Placement Office.

00:28:49	Clubs and organizations: Men's Glee Club, directed by E. Earl Sliney, rehearsed in Music Hall weekly, major concert in Music Hall, also performed in other halls in Madison and other cities; Glee Club had own half-hour radio show on a Janesville station;  Glee Club concerts popular with "town and gown."

00:31:10	Men's Glee Club did concerts with women's Glee Club.  Mixed Chorus.

00:31:29	Arden House; JL took freshman English class from Charlotte Wood; Arden House located between University Avenue and State Street, opposite Music Hall.  Arden House was a rooming house for students interested in English literature; held functions for visiting authors; Rachel Lindsey visited; promoted appearances of literary giants on campus; also a social club, dances.

00:33:35	JL had own show on WHA one semester; JL had taken lessons from Earl Swiney who got inquiries for singers; sang on WHA; Mrs. Lehman, before she knew him, listened to JL's show on the janitor's radio in Fond du Lac where she taught.

00:34:38	Show's format: with accompanist, JL sang for half an hour, took requests.  Shows using student talent were common.

00:35:32	WHA the second oldest radio station in US, facilities at Wingra Park; KDAK, Pittsburgh is oldest station.  Facilities.

00:36:24	JL received pin and key from men's Glee Club, held office.

00:37:14	Publications: Cardinal--excellent, professional quality, remarkable coverage as daily newspaper; The Octopus--funny humor magazine.  Cardinal's point of view represented student attitudes.

00:38:11	Student attitudes: didn't have time to have attitudes; problems of the day were economy, unemployment; fraternity discrimination against Jewish people.

00:38:56	Wisconsin legislature; radicalism meant voting for Norman Thomas and socialist state; JL doesn't remember communist party activity.

00:39:34	Personalities of the day: unclear picture of Scott Goodnight, met him twice, seemed approachable on first meeting regarding transfer credits, second meeting was when JL was chairman of student elections committee--Goodnight was very understanding.

00:40:32	George Sellery was very scholarly.

00:40:45	Glenn Frank had great style, spellbinding speaker, JL's idea of a college president.

00:41:30	Lower end of State Street: legislature, stores around square.

00:41:55	Co-op: books and supplies; Pete Burns and Cog McNeil: JL bought clothes from; later, Pete Burns opened "Pete Burns' Coat and Pant House' on top floor of a San Francisco hotel.  Rennebohm's Drug Store; Chocolate Shoppe, Keeley's Palace of Sweets was its former name, made Keeley's Old Fashioned Chocolates.

00:42:56	State Street merchants.

00:43:11	Police; students racing cars on Langdon Street.

00:43:20	Chili Al's, behind Park Hotel, for steak; Lorraine Hotel for fancy meals; the Willows or Picnic Point for swimming and outdoor recreation; the Chanticleer in Middleton for a nightclub.

00:44:04	Effects of Depression: JL fortunate because his father had a stable job with state government and his father had access to cash during bank crisis; JL sustained some friends during the Depression.  Concerned for others and national economy during depression.  JL was fortunate to have summer jobs.

00:44:45	After graduating with a bachelor's degree it was tougher to get a job, no work in Madison or Chicago, so back to school.  His friends had a hard time finding jobs in their field of study.

00:45:46	New Deal; Federal Emergency Relief Administration had funds for extension division project of hiring twenty economics lecturers--JL worked on this project.  He lectured to 7th graders, Rotary Club in LaCrosse.

00:46:35	In 1934, JL moved to Washington, D.C., because of the better job market.  Became a file clerk for Agriculture Adjustment Administration.

00:46:56	The next year, hired as economist in social and economic research division at Tennessee Valley Authority.  Being from Wisconsin was a great asset.

Tape 1/Side 2

00:47:11	Social Security Act, Waldmeir wrote with Wilbur Cohen who was in Johnson cabinet.

00:47:28	TVA: JL's first professional job, surrounded by people from Wisconsin.  David Lillianthan, from Wisconsin Public Service Commission, was member of TVA's board.

00:47:48	Career goals: earning a living, useful citizen, doing something for society's ills.  Accomplished much of what he set out to do and more.

00:48:57	The intellectual curiosity and broad scope of education at UW helped JL in later in life, high quality education.

00:49:32	Ray Dvorak, UW band conductor.  Fox Midwestco Theatre Show

00:50:31	Eating places: Thompson's Restaurant, Brat House

00:50:47	Recruiting story: Red Gym, Doc Meanwell (basketball coach), Dad Vale (crew coach).

00:51:22	Wisconsin Glee Club held formal concerts, summer concert series at Memorial Union.

00:51:58	Wage and price levels: $.25/hour for draftsman at Agriculture Department; Wisconsin Sauerkraut Association $3000 scholarship for graduate students; FERA lecture project $75/month and $2/day expenses; Washington, D.C. $1440/year less 15%.

00:53:40	Wisconsin Theatre; plays at Bascom Hall.

00:53:56	Luisgee Parandello's "Six Characters in Search of an Author"; Herman Werke a student actor; Werke's Boathouse.

00:54:30	Major dances were prom and military ball.

00:54:40	Big bands were Al Camp, Wayne King, Guy Lombardo.  Big bands played at Memorial Union.

00:55:01	Fletcher Henderson and McKenney's Cotton Pickers play at a military ball.  Bunny Barrigan, a jazz trumpeter, played at fraternity houses.

00:55:24	In the late 1950s, JL was a guest lecturer at the Summer School of Banking in the Sterling Hall auditorium where he took freshman chemistry.  Herb Prochrow, Fayette Elwell.

00:56:08	End of interview.

END