UNIVERSITY OF WISCONSIN-MADISON ARCHIVES
ORAL HISTORY PROGRAM

Interview #900
BERKOWITZ, NORMA

BERKOWITZ, NORMA (née Norma Nesbitt, 1929- )
Clinical Assistant Professor Emerita in the UW-Madison School of Social Work 
At UW: 1967-1993

Interviewed: 	2008 (1 session)	
Interviewer: 	Sandy Pfahler
Index by: 	Allison Page
Length: 	1 hour, 41 minutes

Abstract: Norma Berkowitz received a master’s degree in Social Work from the University of Wisconsin - Madison in the 1960s several years after receiving her undergraduate degree at Penn State.  She discussed the system approach to social work studies that makes the UW-Madison program unique. In 1993 after retiring from the UW-Madison she founded the Friends of Chernobyl Centers United States (FOCCUS) which provides support, education and consultation to 13 community centers in Russia, Belarus and the Ukraine.

Key Words: Beaver Falls PA; music; Geneva College; Pennsylvania State University (Penn State); social work; Madison WI; divorce; University of Wisconsin-Madison; Raymond Munts; Imogene Higbie; Ann Minahan; Allan Pinkus; systems approach to social work; Jack Westman, Wisconsin Cares, Inc.; Waisman Center; London; Leonard Berkowitz; Martin Loeb; Social Work Students for International Outreach; Susan Kidd Webster; retirement; Friends of Chernobyl Centers, US (FOCCUS); Chernobyl, Ukraine; awards; travel.

First Interview Session (January 6, 2008): Digital File

Time	Keywords
00:00:00	Start of Interview/Interviewer’s Introduction

00:00:42	Question: Talk about your early life. Answer: Berkowitz was born in Beaver Falls PA in 1929 to a small family of Scotch-Irish descent that ran a dry-goods store. She talked about her father’s work for insurance and manufacturing companies, her mother’s activities at home and with music, and how her more cosmopolitan aunt sparked her interest in the larger world.

00:05:50	Question: What about your education? Answer: She attended the public schools in Beaver Falls, sharing anecdotes about flunking Latin, playing piano for chorus, and being part of the ushers’ club (which let her get into concerts for free). Follow up: But you were close to Pittsburgh? Answer: Yes, she recalled going to her first opera in one of Pittsburgh’s Masonic temples. Follow up: Did you know you’d go to college? Answer: Yes, her parents supported it and Geneva College was so close to their house that she got teased for it. She decided to major in sociology after dabbling in other majors, but quit after two years of not knowing what she wanted to do.

00:10:30	Question: Then what? Answer: She talked about working writing obituaries for a local newspaper and taking some courses at U. of Pittsburgh until she decided to “settle down” into a major. She described how a trip to a downtown mental institution with a social worker prompted her to major in social work at Penn State. She noted how tight money was and how she got a job as a resident assistant in a dorm in order to get free rooming there. Follow up: Did you enjoy Penn State? Answer: Yes, though they didn’t have a social work BA, her advisor was sympathetic and set up independent clinical experience for her at the only mental institution in the area.

00:17:26	Question: Why not get a MSSW? Answer: After noting that she couldn’t work in medical social work without a master’s, she talked about why it was infeasible for her to get her MSSW due to financial pressures on the family. She got a job as a welfare case worker in Montrose PA. Follow up: What did that involve? Answer: As a “junior visitor,” she talked about a vivid memory of doing a house call in which a family came out with a shotgun. After getting married, she and her husband moved back to State College, where she worked as a secretary for her husband’s organization. 

00:21:59	Question: For how long? Answer: From 1951-1955, when they moved to Madison. She discussed her husband’s new job at National Agricultural Supply Company (NASCO). Follow up: Did you know about the School of Social Work? Answer: No, it wasn’t on her radar, since they had two kids by then. Follow up: What then? Answer: She talked about the strain of her sister and three of their kids being killed in a car accident—soon after this, her husband and her were separated and divorced.

00:24:53	Question: You stayed in Madison? Answer: Yes, she got a job as a case worker in the Jefferson County welfare dept and was taking night courses in Janesville sponsored by UW’s social work school. She related the difficulties of having to work and still trying to advance toward a degree, including flexibility the School had toward her completing a year of her field placement in Jefferson County. In her second field placement year, they moved to Middleton.

00:29:45	Question: Any influential faculty? Answer: Yes, Ray Munts turned policy (a subject of little interest to her) into a fun learning experience; Imogene Higbie attended to “real life relations” in her teaching; and Ann Minahan (who didn’t have a PhD) and Allan Pinkus pioneered a systems approach to social work practice. “And that was me.” She discussed why systems theory was meaningful to her and why it became more widely accepted. So she got her MSSW in 1967. Berkowitz also emphasized her long-time concern with prevention (as opposed to palliative social work) and talked about still being involved in Wisconsin Cares, Inc., founded by Jack Westman.

00:35:46	Question: What did you do in 1967? Answer: Because the federal government was “pooring money into schools of social work” in the 1960s, she applied to and got a stipend through the Div. of Mental Hygiene in the School of Social Work working as a field instructor with Harry Waisman, where she met Leonard Berkowitz. Follow up: What did you do? Answer: She supervised students on their field placements; and she also had some interesting “experiences” at the newly opened Waisman Center.

00:40:25	[no question] Berkowitz quipped about why she had no interest in getting her PhD—she always wanted to be in a “people world” rather than a statistical and academic world. Question: Talk about the Waisman Center. Answer: She talked about being part of the interdisciplinary diagnostic and treatment unit on childhood developmental issues—she described this as “the most exciting thing,” learning every day from different disciplines. She regretted that there was no place in the country today, even at Waisman, where this kind of diagnosis was happening.

00:44:25	Question: Where next? Answer: After this, she was promoted to the head of the inter-disciplinary training committee, at which point she started wondering what more was out there. At this point, Minnie Berkowitz invited her to come to England, where Berkowitz was filling an appointment at Oxford. After applying for a position at the Council for Training in Social Work (CTSW) and travelling to Holland for a conference, she “dropped in” for a job interview, after which she knew that if funding became available, she’d get the job. So she went to London.

00:48:44	Question: What was that experience like? Answer: Fascinating. No degree on social work existed in Britain, but a certificate program was in place supervised by CTSW, with which she worked for two years. It took time to get used to their university system, their writing style, and relationships there. At the same time, Leonard Berkowitz was courting her and Ray Munts extended her leave of absence to try to get her to come back to UW.

00:53:35	[no question] When she returned to UW, she approached Martin Loeb about her 12-month appointment; he then offered her the position of director of field education, a 9-month appointment, in which she worked with the supervisors of students place in hospital and health settings and taught a little on medical social work. Follow up: Did you enjoy that? Answer: Yes, the hospitals had wonderful people. 

00:56:31	[no question] Because of her experience in England, she really became internationally focused and she started Social Work Students for International Outreach (SWSIO), outraged that Social Work had no presence in the international studies field. She regretted that no one in the dept was willing to foster international connections even though social work is historically an international profession.

00:59:26	Question: Is Social Work still primarily a female field? Answer: She thought so. Follow up: What was the culture for women at UW? Answer: She was too busy to pay attention to it; but she didn’t remember experiencing problems with it. One issue she did know about was the status of non-tenured faculty. When the track for clinical faculty was finally established, and the criterion for status was publishing, her work was once again sidelined because she never wanted to do research.

01:05:23	Question: Talk about life since retirement. Answer: First she thought she’d pursue interests in storytelling or architecture. But building on her interest in the world, she accepted an invitation from a friend at London School of Economics to write a volume in a series funded by Soros Foundation on concepts that guide American social workers in medical settings (to help Russian academics teach social policy). Connected with this, she and her colleague in writing the book went to a Moscow conference where she met with bright young professionals hired by UNESCO to staff centers in Chernobyl-affected areas. After these meetings, she determined to set up a project to support these professionals.

01:12:30	[no question] Berkowitz described the genesis of FOCCUS (Friends of Chernobyl Centers, US) in the mid-1990s as part of Institute for International Connections. Follow up: What assistance do you offer? Answer: One of the important things they do is offer hope, but also offer training and grant money for proposals generated by centers. Follow up: Where does the money come from? Answer: Fundraising and personal donations. She described fundraisers and activities they undertook, and related the need the organization had for an executive director, due to the increasing complexity of managing information and running the organization. 

01:19:48	[no question] She talked about recognition for FOCCUS—one from Congress recognizing the organization’s work, a volunteer award for Berkowitz from the State department, and the NASW Foundation Award, among others. Follow up: How are things now? Answer: It depends on who one talks to—the International Atomic Energy Agency was trying to minimize the effects, while victims want to maximize the effects. She expressed her anger at a UN statement that the biggest health problem resulting from Chernobyl was the feeling of victimization. She also talked about the challenges of trying to promote development in the region.

01:24:51	[no question] She again discussed the need to get an executive director because of the financial needs of the organization, talking about a study group going to Chernobyl with new board members David Utley, who had a lot of development experience, and Halyna Traversa Young, a high powered Chicago attorney. During the trip they were going to try to meet with Ukrainian folk rocker Ruslana and the first lady of Ukraine, both of whom had started foundations for Chernobyl.

01:28:47	Question: Do you have other interests? Answer: No, she joked. She expressed that it was time to retire from the presidency of FOCCUS because she didn’t have the energy or time she had when she was younger. Follow up: What is Wisconsin Cares? Answer: She discussed Jack Westman’s work, with the help of her and others, to advocate for restructuring the WI Division of Family Services. The organization had created enough “hullabaloo” to get the division restructured, and they wanted it renamed to the Division of Family Resources.

01:32:20	Question: Plans for retirement? Answer: She wanted to have more time for reading, for friends, for the Global Health Colloquium, and for CREECA. Question: Family? Answer: She talked about Leonard’s two daughters and five grandchildren and her own two sons and two grandsons

01:36:53	Question: Anything else? Answer: She observed enjoying the experience of going back through her papers from graduate school for the interview and that she was satisfied with who she was.  She also talked about enjoying life with her husband Leonard, reading and traveling. Follow up: Where would you like to go back? Answer: She said they went back to London a lot, and recounted the places she and Leonard had traveled, especially for their honeymoon.

01:41:27	End of First Interview Session 

End of Oral History #900